West Ham United 25/26 relegation thread

[muskie]

Odds slashed from 5/1 to 7/2.

Watch this space.

I think we're fucked.

[Rossal]

" you are pissing in the wind if you think all our accounts are legit". 

I suggest you contact the club auditors, Deloittes, with your concerns. Or repeat that opinion, in the public domain under your own name and see what the reactions of Deloittes are.

Just do some research. There has been two reports posted in the past few weeks of our accounts which are interesting. 


You can then research Delliottes and see theyve been investigated and had some scandals this year. 

[Westside]

" you are pissing in the wind if you think all our accounts are legit". 

I suggest you contact the club auditors, Deloittes, with your concerns. Or repeat that opinion, in the public domain under your own name and see what the reactions of Deloittes are.

[Massive Attack]

Yeah that was others discussing it, I just remember those leeching wankers eager on selling the place before finding out they got £40M which stank like fuck as we then moved in to a rented high capacity stadium on peppercorn rent of about £2.5M a year at the time we moved in.

[Keep dreaming]

The sale of Upton park went to pey shareholders loans and to secure the loan of the shitbowl.

Nothing was pent into players...

And this highlights Sullivan's tenure. Small pocket Scrooge fit for championship or less

[Westside]

 

To trouser the profit on player sales, via interest on loans, he would have to lend the club an insane amount of money. If he wanted to take out say £50 million a year in interest, he'd have to lend the club a £ billion first, at 5% annually. Doubt he has the resources or inclination to do that.

He has trousered money, done it with the sale of Upton Park.  

Make a good point there. Of that £40M sale I think just £15M went towards 'conversion' costs of the Shithole. Add that to the leeching interest rate amongst other factors and it is clear they do take a pretty penny out of our Club.

 

 

He may well have trousered money from the Upton Park sale, difficult to prove. The proceeds went into the club. However, I've asked the specific questuion of how he is/will trouser money on player sales in the future which nobody has answered.

[Keep dreaming]

Not sure how reliable AI is, but this is what I got from this simple answer:

how much money does David Sullivan make per year from West Ham United FC, and how much money has he as an owner put into the club from his own wealth

------

David Sullivan does not take a salary or receive dividends from West Ham United FC. His investment in the club has primarily been through shareholder loans and share purchases, with a net investment estimated at around £15 million over a 15-year period as of May 2025. 

Owners David Sullivan and the late David Gold have never been paid a salary or dividend from West Ham United. However, they did collect significant interest payments on the loans they provided to the club, totaling approximately £23.3 million over the years. 

Share Purchases: Sullivan has paid a net of approximately £26.85 million through share purchases.Loans: The owners provided shareholder loans, which at one point reached £49.2 million by the end of the 2013/14 season.
 Net Investment: Accounting for money put in (loans and shares) and money taken out (interest payments), Sullivan's total net investment is estimated to be around £15 million. 
 This is considered a relatively low investment compared to other Premier League owners. The current ownership structure is complex, with Daniel Kretinsky acquiring a 27% stake in 2021, which injected an additional £125 million of equity used to invest in the playing squad and repay the owners' loans. 

[Massive Attack]

There's plenty of money connected to player sales that would wipe out much of the debt issues. I won't pay too much attention to the debt spinning bollocks that'll be relentless crap emanating from the Porn Fort.

[Sir Alf]

Yep the “debt” propaganda will be relentless from now on. Aside from Bowen, Paqueta, Todibo being sold it will justify why we had no choice but sell Fernandes, Magassa and Diouf even though it may have been possible to try keep them for a season.

Those Brum fans words 15 years ago were a dark warning about our new owners. It took a while but having Sullivan running the show has left the club in ruins.

 

[Massive Attack]

And by lending money to the club with insane interest 

 

To trouser the profit on player sales, via interest on loans, he would have to lend the club an insane amount of money. If he wanted to take out say £50 million a year in interest, he'd have to lend the club a £ billion first, at 5% annually. Doubt he has the resources or inclination to do that.

He has trousered money, done it with the sale of Upton Park.  

Make a good point there. Of that £40M sale I think just £15M went towards 'conversion' costs of the Shithole. Add that to the leeching interest rate amongst other factors and it is clear they do take a pretty penny out of our Club.

[Rossal]

Right on cue, his gimp Whetstone tweets that our accounts for the end of 24/25 show losses of £100m and this season on track for the same. 

Lining things up to sell sell sell or not spend in Jan 

[Rossal]

How exactly is he going to "pocket the cash" from player sales?
(spoiler alert - he can't)

the only way Sullivan makes any money is by selling his shares.
40 odd % of £800m is worth much more than 40 odd % of £300m.





 

And by lending money to the club with insane interest 

 

To trouser the profit on player sales, via interest on loans, he would have to lend the club an insane amount of money. If he wanted to take out say £50 million a year in interest, he'd have to lend the club a £ billion first, at 5% annually. Doubt he has the resources or inclination to do that.

He has trousered money, done it with the sale of Upton Park.  Does it with his shady agent mates.  He'll do it again once we go down. The bloke is a slimy weasel, you are pissing in the wind if you think all our accounts are legit and all the money earned has been reinvested into the club. 

I guess if he is so keen to stay up he will have to find a minimum of £30 million this month, probably closer to £50m to bulk out the squad with enough quality to give us a chance.   Let's see if he'll get his chequebook out....... I am sceptical. 

[Westside]

How exactly is he going to "pocket the cash" from player sales?
(spoiler alert - he can't)

the only way Sullivan makes any money is by selling his shares.
40 odd % of £800m is worth much more than 40 odd % of £300m.




 

And by lending money to the club with insane interest 

 

 

To trouser the profit on player sales, via interest on loans, he would have to lend the club an insane amount of money. If he wanted to take out say £50 million a year in interest, he'd have to lend the club a £ billion first, at 5% annually. Doubt he has the resources or inclination to do that.

[Westside]

When at the Boleyn when they first bought us on the cheap the spivs chucked on interest like you say, yet acted lile they were doing us a massive favour! Can't remember exactly how much it was but 9% sounds about right. Cheeky leeching cunts.

The interest rate in the earleir years was 6 - 7%. They didn't take the interest on the drip, but only when the loans were repaid.

Better than borrowing from the banks who would have wanted security, or place some restrcitive covenants on the club. Especially as our finances were very poor at the time. Those loans may have saved us from administration. 

Don't mind them trying to be businessmen, but don't pretend to be fans, when other clubs fan owners lend money interest free.

[El Scorchio]

the clubs most valuable asset is premier league membership. 

That's how I understand it. They wanted the Stadium on the cheap I reckon which hasnt materialised so now their biggest asset is the Premier League membership. Player sales will boost it but as we are hurtling towards a probable relegation, their valuations will be shaved off. The Training Grounds are tinpot. The membership and all that brings like TV/Sponsorship Etc is what matters most and they're on course to currently losing it.

 

 

Too right. I reckon the prospect of getting their hands on the stadium for peanuts after the government gets fed up of it is the only thing keeping them clinging on with their greasy fingers. If not forced out before, I reckon they sell up immediately or as soon ans they are allowed after getting it. 

Kretinsky is known for buying broken businesses on the cheap isn’t he? Wonder if he’s just twiddling his thumbs until Sullivan fully digs his own grave before swooping on the cheap. Which is pretty cunty making us all suffer in the meantime but I guess from a cold hard business POV it makes sense. I just don’t understand why he’d buy in the amount he has and negotiate a fixed price only to sit there when the shares needed to take over are up for grabs. 

Has to be all about acquiring the stadium. Just wonder if and when the government will actually crack. 

[Massive Attack]

When at the Boleyn when they first bought us on the cheap the spivs chucked on interest like you say, yet acted lile they were doing us a massive favour! Can't remember exactly how much it was but 9% sounds about right. Cheeky leeching cunts.

[El Scorchio]

They did do this in the past. 9% was it? But not for a long time. Doesn’t change the fact they ‘never took a penny in wages’ but leeched millions out of the club still, when it was the norm ‘I believe’ for owners to make interest free loans. 

They just get payday loans from other places now. Still run in farcical fashion in tandem with the crazy unsustainable money drain buy expensive sell cheap or give away for free transfer policy which he thinks is a suitable way to run a football club flying in the face of the undoubted proof that it isn’t, looking at several other clubs who are flourishing with other sustainable business models and philosophies. 

[Massive Attack]

the clubs most valuable asset is premier league membership. 

That's how I understand it. They wanted the Stadium on the cheap I reckon which hasnt materialised so now their biggest asset is the Premier League membership. Player sales will boost it but as we are hurtling towards a probable relegation, their valuations will be shaved off. The Training Grounds are tinpot. The membership and all that brings like TV/Sponsorship Etc is what matters most and they're on course to currently losing it.

[Westside]

Why do you keep saying he’s gonna pocket loads of cash when that simply isn’t the case?

the clubs most valuable asset is premier league membership. With that comes a couple of hundred million of income every year.

As Goose says, buyers are not primarily interested in physical assets like the training ground, players etc. Buyers are after Premier League income streams and the potential to grow the value of the club (on pitch success, getting more money buy finishing higher up the league European football etc). None of which we are guaranteed and looking less likely by the match, for us.

And for those of you convinced that Sullivan can "trouser" player sale proceeds, please explain the mechanics of this.

I am firmly in the fuck off Sullivan camp  (yes, I've signed the petition). There are many brickbats to smash him with, but selling players to line his pockets, isn't one of them.

Wouldn't he have he done that when we sold Rice, for a pure profit north of £100 million, if he was going to do it?

All that and much, much more has been spent on players (very badly), why would that have happened if Sullivan wanted to asset strip players for cash?

[goose]

Why do you keep saying he’s gonna pocket loads of cash when that simply isn’t the case?

the clubs most valuable asset is premier league membership. With that comes a couple of hundred million of income every year.

[Rossal]

Honestly mate, that's a proper long of old gunk you're spouting there.

there's plenty of intel, videos and people de-constructing the accounts to back it all up.  You can't keep spending £40m on Kilmans, JWP, Hallers, giving 100k a with to Guido with fuck all in return and expect us to keep going. 

[XKhammer]

How exactly is he going to "pocket the cash" from player sales?
(spoiler alert - he can't)

the only way Sullivan makes any money is by selling his shares.
40 odd % of £800m is worth much more than 40 odd % of £300m.



 

And by lending money to the club with insane interest 

Utter rubbish 
lf you want to beat Sullivan do it with facts rather than fairytales 
Unusually l have to agree with goose 

[Eerie Decent]

Honestly mate, that's a proper load of old gunk you're spouting there.

[Rossal]

It's fucking BIZARRE to think the owner of a billion pound asset would be happy to roll the dice, shave off at least 50% of it's value, and hope to pick up a few million quid for players sales that are not guaranteed.

There is nothing sinister going on ffs. The man is just fucking incompetent at running a football club in the modern era.

We've run out of money.  Years of borrowing fuck loads and spending it on shit with no returns will finally catch up with us.   To stay in the prem we need massive shareholder investment or he can go down pocket loads of cash and try and bounce back up......or fuck off. 

Also are we a billion pound asset?  We have TV money and some decent players what else is there?   some porta-cabins in Rush Green ......

Look at the state he left Birmingham City in, why does everyone assume he will do different here.....and that was when he owned the stadium as an asset ffs. 

[Massive Attack]

Definitely down to incompetency. 

[Westside]

Listened to the Bobby Moore Stand last night.  Anyone know if they are in the loop well or not?  

They had a section describing our finances and basically if we go down we sound absolutely fucked financially. We've borrowed and mortgaged our selves up to the eyeballs and we still owe shit loads on transfer payments and wrote off most of our incoming payments to buy the shit that we have the last 2-3 years. 

That investment in players has provided nothing but players worth a fraction of what we bought them for. It all just sounds one big mess. 

The main guy, Gary is it?   is convinced Sullivan is happy to go down to strip the squad of most its value and then scarper. As we don't own a stadium or much in assets is the most valuable part of the club the squad. He can strip that then sell it for whatever he wants and fuck off into the sunset with his brass of a mrs. 





 

 

 

To be an asset stripping firesale of players, walk off into the sunset with the cash scenario (via a huge one off dividend), with Sullivan only owning 38.8% of the shares at least one other shareholder (more shareholders dependant on which one involved)  would have to agree to the process.

If he sold his shares he would pay Capital Gains Tax, but the original purchase costs of his shares would be deducted in calulating the tax bill. No such deduction if a dividend is taken His likely dividend tax rate would be 39.75% (current rate) as opposed to 24% Capital Gains Tax.

Given the above, there is no way Sullivan will clean out his cash, with a dividend, rather than selling up. And the value of the club sold (even if relegated) would be massively higher ( a multiple of at least 5) than the amount that could be taken in dividends (limited by company law, in West Ham's case maximum dividend, would be the current year profit).

He stopped taking loan interest over 4 years ago, when the loans were repaid and he was charging an insane 4% (higher in earlier years).

Our credit card is maxed out. We owe masses on player transfers (£190 million at 31/05/2024) and as others have said virtually nothing left on player sales incoming (Kudus excepted) as the Rice debt was sold at a discount, to fund summer 2024 transfer expenditure.

The accounts for last seaon will be revealing. These are normally published mid January (not leaglly due until the end of February) and will give a very good indication of our PSR limits.